Wowpedia talk:Image guidelines

Copyright
What do we do about copyright? I have recently updated a few scans of The Art of World of Warcraft. I know those will not be considered screenshots or promotional material. I don't see any copyright labellings instructions here. On Wikipedia, I would only be able to post stuff like those if there is not any alternatives. --Voidvector 23:08, 2 January 2007 (EST)

WoW Model Viewer
What about images excerpt from the official WoW model viewer ? Do they fall under the "datamined" category ?-- K )  (talk) 02:02, 6 January 2007 (EST)


 * Dressing room is not considered datamined if that is what you mean. However, I am not sure what "official WoW model viewer" is. --Voidvector 02:08, 6 January 2007 (EST)


 * There is nothing official about it. WoW model viewer screenshots are frowned upon (and a complete no-no for unreleased content), we much prefer proper in-game shots. I would say use your common sense for exceptions to this, for example if such a screenshot is much better than any that can be obtained normally. -- 10:16, 6 January 2007 (EST)


 * I have to say...NO model viewer pictures allowed? Ouch.  What is so bad about using it to get nice, clean, transparent pictures of released content to fill out articles?  I just don't understand the hatred for this program. I have found it very useful as a tool for helping fill out pages on creatures, but this new policy has ground that to a halt.  --Presea 11:33, 26 January 2007 (EST)

I didn't say that, they're just frowned upon normally. Basically the reasons are: Having said the above, professionally done transparent images = awesome, and by all means add them to appropriate articles! There have been some excellent additions to creature pages this way. They are, however, completely inappropriate for NPC pages. I might add some info to the image guidelines as it is, but I don't want to get too specific. I harbour to hatred towards the program, it's just that in many cases the results are less than perfect. 11:50, 26 January 2007 (EST)
 * 1) The resulting images often look bad (from inexperienced use)
 * 2) In-game screenshots are more appropriate
 * 3) Unreleased content often comes from it


 * But one of the rules when you go to upload an image is "Datamined pictures are not allowed" (wouldn't that be datamined pictures of unreleased content?). And several NPC pages without an image is is specifically requested that a screenshot be added.  Are images for what I did for many pages of beasts (example:  Den Mother) okay?  The policy on model viewer pictures is rather confusing and contradicts itself in some spots.  --Presea 13:33, 27 January 2007 (EST)


 * Thanks for pointing that out - I've updated the upload page! Yes, what you did for Den Mother was good, though I might suggest increasing the image size and padding. Really though, for specific NPCs and mobs, I would prefer an in-location shot if possible. There is no policy on the use of model viewer, just guidelines and some policies on the kinds of images that we accept :) 13:56, 27 January 2007 (EST)

No WoW Model viewer pictures allowed? Not all are datamined but what about T6? All the images of that are likely datamined from private servers and such. It can be put to good use though for pictures that are actually ingame and pages that need pictures that are actually ingame. Cabeza


 * I've given in and have added a WMV section to the guidelines :) 18:36, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

WoW Map Viewer
Im assuming that the same that holds true for the WoW Model Viewer holds true for WoW Map Viewer, and that any images of unreleased material (Azshara Crater for example) are prohibited. Valros 10:20, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

Compression
So maybe this is a dumb question, but I'm not really sure how to compress my jpg images. I know you say they have to be compressed to at least 90%, but I just don't know what that means or how to do it. I have lots of images I would like to contribute, please let me know how. -- < Jiyambi >    talk  || contrib  01:57, 29 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Many image editing programs ask you what level of quality you want your image to be as soon as you try to save it as a JPEG, the default is 90%, I'm not sure what MS Paint saves JPEGs as. Valros 10:24, 10 February 2008 (UTC)

New Machinima Guidelines
Blizzard recently (and quietly) set guidelines for the Machinima community (i.e. fan-made WoW videos, etc.). These guidelines may be found on the Blizzard site. To summarize, it allows players to use "video images, footage, music, sounds, speech, or other assets from its copyrighted products" subject to a few conditions, namely that it is not distributed for profit. In a way this makes certain exceptions from the EULA and ToU.

Perhaps we'd like to discuss how this may affect our image guidelines? This certainly does not say that datamining content is now allowed, but Model Viewer now falls in the gray area in my mind, as long as you're not viewing unreleased items. -- 14:36, 3 October 2007 (UTC)

Dryder
Can I upload an image labeled "Dryder" which is a humanoid Nerubian? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by.


 * If it's unreleased content, no ... but I would still like to see it :) 03:07, 6 October 2007 (UTC)


 * The model is used by High Priestess Mar'li. -- 02:43, 10 October 2007 (UTC)


 * He put it on the Nerubian page in the infobox. I frowned on it and gave it a fact check.-- 22:02, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Fanart/Drawings
Hi, I'm working on my character article, and I was wondering if I could upload an image I drew for my character. (I'm an ameteur artist) Would that violate anything? I'm only going to use it for a non-canonical article.--Blayaden 23:00, 3 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Fanart is allowed 100% on peronal articles.-- 21:58, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

TCG
I looked around but couldn't find any specific information, so here's my question: what are the rules on posting TCG pictures? There's lots of great art out there of important and even secondary characters, such as Reginald Windsor, which would look great on their respective pages. I noticed that some have them - ie. Tyrande, Zalazane - and many, like Windsor, don't.

What's the rule here? What sources are safe to get TCG images from and which aren't? Just so I'm not crossing any legal boundaries. --Pure.Wasted 03:44, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * It's safe. I know we have a Ragnaros picture around here somewhere. >.> -- Sky (talk | con | wh ) 06:43, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Discourage images with web addresses on them?
I think we should have a a guideline to not use images with web addresses in them, like "www.wowguru.com" or something like that. I'm not sure how to word it, though. -- Fandyllic  (talk · contr) 10:24 AM PST 30 Dec 2007

Naming
Should we add something to the effect of:

"Do not upload images using WoW's default screenshot name (eg: Image:ScreenShot 123007 001730.jpeg). Rename your image so it's relevant for the content it's showing (eg: Image:Tinhead.jpeg)."

-- k _d3 19:33, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes. --Sky (t | c | w ) 19:37, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

Size & Compression Standards
Shouldn't the Wiki favor the highest resolution/quality available for most images? There is little/no difference in bandwidth used for the automatically generated thumbnails seen in articles, and surely storage space should not be an issue in this day and age. --MaTrIx 03:58, 14 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Indeed. I prefer to upload PNG images, but the guys in charge complains about them taking up too much space. I agree with MaTrIx on this. Xavius, the Satyr Lord (talk) 13:17, 14 July 2008 (UTC)


 * It's not a storage issue, it's a page size issue - high quality images mean longer page loads. To compare JPG and PNG thumbnails, you see the JPG is under 15KB, whilst the PNG is over 110KB. (The 150KB warning you get when uploading screenshots is ridiculous, and I hope to get it increased.) 13:25, 14 July 2008 (UTC)

It appears resized JPG quality is hardcoded at 80%, whereas PNG is hardcoded at 95%. I think it may not be possible to change this. 13:39, 14 July 2008 (UTC)


 * So... to bring this back up, are we in favor of less loading time (JPG) or higher quality (PNG)? 20:36, 16 July 2008 (UTC)
 * PNG 21:52, 17 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Very well, all of Xavius's PNG files have been reduced to under 250KBs and all jpg files have been marked for deletion. 04:21, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

NPCs in Images: Selected or Not?
I demand a vote on the subject to commence at once. The colored circles beneath the NPCs, in my opinion, seriously detract from, if not the quality, then at least the experience of the image. Seriously, at least some try to percieve the characters as real (well, you know what I mean), and colored circles do NOT fit into that equation! So I, as first voter, votes No on the issue of "Should NPCs in images be selected"! Xavius, the Satyr Lord (talk) 13:17, 14 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't particularly care either way; as long as the NPC is the only one in the picture, it should be obvious enough without the selection. But I don't see the colored selection circles as a detraction from immersion as a valid reason to not have them. -- 13:25, 14 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I personally think the model highlight that comes from selecting a character helps with the image - can you get that without the green circle? 13:34, 14 July 2008 (UTC)


 * That's a good point, but you can get the same highlight by mousing over the NPC or its nameplate, if that helps at all. -- 13:40, 14 July 2008 (UTC)


 * Indeed - I think the lighting highlight may have been part of the original reason for it. I would support altering it to just be mouse-over highlight. 13:58, 14 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I do agree screenshots are nicer without the circles... but images should be updated with new files, not completely replaced with a new file name or file type... especially if the original image is not being marked for deletion, if it continues as it was being done we'll soon have a ton of images not being used, but taking up space. And since everything I had done was just undone (minus removing the speedydelete tags from the now once again used images) I'm going to just stand over here and watch, while I go back to my other project of creating object pages. 21:41, 14 July 2008 (UTC)

Max size
I just updated the max size to 500kb, to move with the times. I thought it had already been increased per a VP discussion, but I was apparently wrong :P 15:54, 4 November 2008 (UTC)

Image Dimensions
Maybe i have missed this, but does the "thumb" option automatically set the actual dimensions (ie pixel height and width) of the image, or can the dimensions be set by the user. For example on this page Grizzlemaw why are the images 2 different dimensions? WoWWiki-Daos (talk) 07:35, 8 January 2009 (UTC)


 * They have different defined sizes; one is 260px wide and the other is 240px wide. 07:36, 8 January 2009 (UTC)

Show the NPC selected
I was wondering if this still meant selected as in with the green circle on the character selected, as in just the character highlighted, or just any image of the character? Rolandius ( talk  -  contr ) 10:54, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * It should still be highlighted. You don't have to have them selected, you can simply mouse over the character to highlight them. -- 11:51, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

New image versions
Is it possible to upload new versions of an image with a different file name extension than the original, and still have them show up on the same page as an update? I'm talking about making PNGs into JPGs to decrease file size etc., when resizing is not an option. There is after all no existing image to overwrite. Narasen (talk) 12:13, 12 August 2009 (UTC)


 * It's not, as the full image name is the identifier - e.g. Arthas.png and Arthas.jpg can be two completely different pictures. 16:44, November 3, 2009 (UTC)

Programs
The simple step to taking screenshots from in-game is simple; but considering NPC screenshots. NPC screenshots are like,
 * 1) Getting into position
 * 2) hide names and the selection circle, hide UI
 * 3) take the screenshot
 * 4) Find the screenshot and crop it

But another good way to take a screenshot and doing a crop at the same time is with software like lightshot (free) or ScreenToGif (open source). We should make a new section on "Make taking screenshots easier to do" and recommend like those two programs I suggested. 01:34, 24 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Sure, there is also Snipping Tool preinstalled on modern Windows systems. -- (•) 01:48, 24 December 2017 (UTC)
 * That could do the trick too! I've added a section, feel free to make improvements! 02:01, 24 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I have names disabled per standard for this reason and I have paint on my toolbar. I get in positon for the shot, press print screen, I open paint, paste, crop and save. Easy peasy lemon squeezy. That being said, a guide is a good idea :) PeterWind (talk) 02:24, 24 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I better not make the guide ... I'd be a little sarcastic with it and just have two words on the guide. 'Hit PrintScn'. 20:55, 24 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Be a little enthusiastic so it'll just work. 01:22, 25 December 2017 (UTC)

IRL things
Here is my proposal to add the following:


 * IRL images should...
 * NOT contain anything else other than the item itself
 * Be taken on a white background or greenscreen
 * Be cropped to the item itself if need be
 * Example item

- 16:57, 16 January 2018 (UTC)
 * I would suggest instead of specifying "white background or greenscreen" just say "against a background of a solid color" as some cases may be more suited a black background or such. -- (•) 18:14, 16 January 2018 (UTC)


 * IRL images should...
 * NOT contain anything else other than the item itself
 * Be taken against a background of a solid color
 * Preferably a black background or using a greenscreen
 * Be cropped to the item itself if need be
 * Example item

How about that? - 18:28, 16 January 2018 (UTC)
 * It's OK. I'm not too sure about the IRL terminology, but I can't think of another way to phrase it without awkward wording. -- (•) 19:15, 16 January 2018 (UTC)


 * I've changed that to A item in real life for the time being, unless someone can think of something more proper. 20:15, 16 January 2018 (UTC)
 * Nice guide! I'll add one line to the NPC part. PeterWind (talk) 21:57, 16 January 2018 (UTC)

Galleries
You think it might be good to provide information on the  for the tag? 18:07, 30 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Sure. We should probably incorporate references to the gallery help article on mediawiki.org. -- k_d3 22:20, 30 July 2018 (UTC)
 * I was actually wondering where to find more about the mode parameter options. -- MyMindWontQuiet 23:21, 30 July 2018 (UTC)

PNGs and JPGs
This is a guideline proposal. So if it were to be approved, it is a recommendation but it is not required.
 * PNG for anything that transparency would be needed (logos, icons, etc.)
 * JPG for anything related to screenshots or artwork, such as concept art, locations, NPCs, Mobs, items, etc.

Some exceptions may include: 21:59, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If a screenshot was uploaded in PNG format (such as an item, NPC, or a location) and is at least around or below the 800 kb file size.. then it isn't worth to convert it to JPG.


 * Disagree, or rather I don't think I have much reason to agree. There is no situation where JPG is superior to PNG, PNG is better in every aspect. It preserves transparency and is lossless, important things that JPG cannot do, and does everything that JPG can do.
 * I cannot understand the need to constantly convert PNG pics to JPG, specially when it's done on < 1Mb pics. It provides literally no improvement, and actually causes the pic to lose information and quality.
 * But first, I think we need to talk about the file size limit before all that, as User:Kaydeethree wanted. 800Kb was fine 10 years ago, but is way too low for today's uses, specially when every single media including Blizzard often uses > 1-2Mb pics. And, something very important that often seems to be forgotten, is that Wowpedia does not lack diskspace. If someone plans to use the argument that JPG pics can sometimes be lighter than PNG ones, well it is of no concern. There is no issue with us hosting "heavy" (according to the current Wowpedia 'guideline', of course) pictures. Space is virtually unlimited !-- MyMindWontQuiet 22:36, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Everything lacks diskspace. Nothing lasts forever. 22:45, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * If the people in charge of Wowpedia themselves say that Wowpedia does not lack diskspace, I don't think we need worry about it or about saving a few hundred kilobytes per pic. :P -- MyMindWontQuiet 23:08, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * After all this is a guideline proposal, not a policy. 23:09, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * I only included the exception for 800 kb because the guideline says that is the maximum file size recommended. If the guideline were to increase, that exception would increase. 23:14, 11 September 2018 (UTC)

Increase maximum size recommendation
Just what the title of the section says, we should increase the maximum size limit or just remove it and just use the wiki maximum as the file size limit (8 MB). 14:33, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Agreed about an increase of the file size limit. It was maybe fine 10 years ago but it's outdated now. -- MyMindWontQuiet 14:37, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * PCJ went ahead and removed the entire section. poggers 14:41, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Mh, let's be cautious about not having people needlessly upload 10mb-sized files when simple compression should bring them to 800kbs either... oh well. Xporc (talk) 15:26, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Maximum file size is 8 MB. 10 MB is impossible. 15:28, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I know, I'm exaggerating. It's just that I've already seen people upload 3.5mb wow screenshots when a simple lossless compression brought them back to 800kbs. Xporc (talk) 15:40, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Of course a compression would still be recommended. 15:47, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * So what about the whole jpg/png question. Do we no longer care as long as it's "within" the limits? PeterWind (talk) 17:21, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, pretty much. But I personally like to have screenshots (zones, NPCs, etc.) in jpg format. 17:56, 1 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I'll keep my screenshots in jpg, but I guess I'll lay off on the reformatting of the screenshots of other editors then. PeterWind (talk) 18:21, 1 October 2018 (UTC)