Talk:Dark Iron dwarf

What does this sloppy page add?-- 22:40, 18 March 2016 (UTC)


 * Why sloppy? There are the hill dwarf and mountain dwarf pages so I think there should be one for the dark dwarves. Dark dwarves shouldn't be redirect to the Dark Iron clan as not all dark dwarves are part of the clan. What others think? --Mordecay (talk) 09:54, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
 * While the page doesn't add much, I agree with Mord that it should exist. As he says, not all dark dwarves belong to the Dark Iron clans. Cemotucu (talk contribs) 11:24, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Well, if needed, the page can be updated with appearance section and maybe history section with an explanation (if any exists, not sure here) why the split of the two independent groups and the Dark Iron clan. Btw, doesn't the Chronicle add anything new to the dark dwarves? --Mordecay (talk) 11:38, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
 * To my knowledge, the Thorium Brotherhood isn't affiliated with the Dark Iron Clan. Which in itself should be enough reason, I believe at least, to keep the two pages seperate. PeterWind (talk) 15:48, 19 March 2016 (UTC)
 * The Thorium Brotherhood is independent, as is Mountain-Lord Rendan and his cronies. -- 16:56, 19 March 2016 (UTC)

I don't think this name will be used.-- 20:06, 3 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Let's wait a few months before doing anything too drastic :D Xporc (talk) 20:20, 3 November 2017 (UTC)
 * I can cite it now. One thing calls them this name.-- 20:21, 3 November 2017 (UTC)

Dark dwarf/Dark Iron dwarf
If we do that, then we retire the hill dwarf/mountain dwarf/frost dwarf pages as well, then? Xporc (talk) 12:16, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
 * I imagine the Dark Iron dwarf would stay as a type of dwarf race along wit the hill / mountain / frost dwarf? --Mordecay (talk) 12:24, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
 * But if we assume that dwarves that originated from the Dark Iron clan are "Dark Iron dwarves" even after they left the clan, surely normal dwarves would be called Bronzebeard dwarves instead of hill, mountain, hobbit hole or something Xporc (talk) 13:05, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Since the frost dwarf page is essentially retired and people want to remove the dark dwarf page, do we also retire hill dwarf/mountain dwarf? Xporc (talk) 07:25, 30 March 2018 (UTC)
 * What??? No. 07:25, 31 March 2018 (UTC)


 * Essentially all those dwarfs are pretty much a "type" of dwarf you can find throughout Azeroth. I'd call it subspecies but that might seem humanist. 07:28, 31 March 2018 (UTC)

Dark irons vs Dark Iron clan
You can be a dark iron dwarf (aka dark dwarf), and you can be not affiliated with the Dark Iron clan, hence the Thorium Brotherhood. --Mordecay (talk) 23:01, 7 February 2018 (UTC)


 * For what I understand, the Thorium were all Dark Iron members until they became independent. But the most important thing, aren't all Dark dwarves, Dark Iron dwarves? I think they are, I mean, the reason of why they have red eyes and some other characteristics is because those were a gift from Ragnaros when he enslaved them, no? Correct me if I'm wrong I don't know the whole story. --Ryon21 (talk) 06:02, 8 February 2018 (UTC)


 * Oh, there's no doubts that all the dark-skinned, red-eyed dwarves originally came from the Dark Iron clan. I'm just reluctant to have their race named as "Dark Iron dwarf" when there are so many of them who left the Dark Iron clan. Xporc (talk) 12:33, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Though, the Thorium Brotherhood left the dark iron clan and they are still called dark iron dwarves a few times. Volume 3 and the Dark Iron allied race may give some more information. -- MyMindWontQuiet 13:05, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * "Waiting for Chronicles 3" is starting to become a meme at this point :D Xporc (talk) 13:15, 8 February 2018 (UTC)


 * Is it explicitly stated that the Thorium Brotherhood was originally part of and eventually left the Dark Iron clan? --Mordecay (talk) 13:34, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Evonice_Sootsmoker Xporc (talk) 13:50, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * That says they lived in the Depths not that they were members of the clan. Look at the pages of other "clans". They are presumed to be a part of the Dark Iron clan, as exact relations and affiliations of those clans or groups are not stated anywhere. Speculatively, all those groups would be a part of the Dark Iron Nation that is referenced in a quest. --Mordecay (talk) 15:46, 8 February 2018 (UTC)


 * So your point is that all dark dwarves would be called "Dark Iron dwarves", and be part of the "Dark Iron Nation", and that the "Dark Iron clan" itself is part of the Dark Iron Nation but not its main component? Xporc (talk) 16:04, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Since the Dark Iron clan is the major clan of the dark dwarves and the emperor of the Depths was Emperor Thaurissan, the Dark Iron clan would be the main component of the Nation, no? --Mordecay (talk) 16:33, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Summarizing, we'll just wait until the meme Chronicle 3 comes out and its explanation about the events of the dungeons in Blackrock (I hope, with Blizz who knows) and the Thorium. Then, we'll see how the dark dwarves are referenced there. 47 days to go. --Ryon21 (talk) 17:28, 8 February 2018 (UTC)
 * The term "dark iron dwarf" is used throughout the book. No mention is ever made of different groups, except insofar as some supported Moira and some sided with the Twilight's Hammer. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 00:34, 30 March 2018 (UTC)


 * Is it "Dark iron dwarf" or "Dark Iron dwarf"? also, if all dark dwarves are actually called "Dark Iron dwarves", how do we handle those dwarves not belonging to the Dark Iron clan faction? See :Category:Dark dwarf characters and Category:Dark Iron dwarf characters for what I mean. Most of these guys are already tagged as part of another sub-faction (counting the Darkmoon Faire, Twilight's Hammer, Conclave, Thorium Brotherhood, Venture Company, Shadow Council ...) so the question is essentially about Mountain-Lord Rendan and his pals. We could chose to lose the differentiation, but I'm not sure it'd be the best outcome. Xporc (talk) 07:23, 30 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Glancing through, the capitalization seems to be consistent as "Dark Iron dwarf." Personally, I've always been really dubious about "dark dwarf," since it's a term that's used in exactly one place and then indirectly (Brann's notes listing the types of dwarves as Mountain, Hill, Frost, and Dark). Personally I wouldn't mind merging both of those categories; it would make it consistent with things like Category:Wildhammer dwarf characters. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 08:11, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

Move
Ok, I think we've now been seeing enough evidence to move the "Dark dwarf" page to "Dark Iron dwarf". I just want this to happen cleanly and properly, like we did the Mag'har the other day. So I'll take care of it soon enough! Xporc (talk) 15:49, 3 May 2018 (UTC)
 * :thumbsup: --Ryon21 (talk) 17:35, 3 May 2018 (UTC)

Black Anvil
So, i'm starting to wonder...is the Black Anvil a religious thing for the Dark Iron Clan? Like, one of the farewells is 'May the Black Anvil bless you" along with 'Forges glow watch over you'...so...doesn't that sound like some religious reverence at least?--Tbond15 (talk) 21:59, 4 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Interesting question. I think it's more of a cultural thing than a religious one. Considering the amount of names like ANVILrage or AngerFORGE, it's obvious blacksmithing is important to Dark Iron culture. So the only anvil able to forge the Dark Iron ore would be important to the Dark Iron dwarves as a people Xporc (talk) 07:20, 5 September 2019 (UTC)

Alliance affiliation
Should we add something like "Though the majority of them are members of the *Alliance-affiliated* Dark Iron clan..." to the page? At a quick glance on this page you can't really see that the main Dark Iron clan is a part of the Alliance, in my opinion. - Hammerture
 * These pages need an update, but the main Dark Iron clan is part of the Alliance and I'd say the majority of them are too. Especially since Shadowforge is an Alliance city. The only ones against it are a sect that want to resurrect Ragnaros, which name I cannot remember. Scratch that, it's the Cult of Ragnaros. But yeah, these pages are the hella outdated. --Ryon21 (talk) 03:00, 26 April 2020 (UTC)