Talk:Undead dragon

OK, see, here's my thoughts on this page. First of all, I'm not really sure that the frost wyrms of the Scourge are actually their own flight so much as just a collection of undead dragons. Further evidence towards this is that the Scourge, as of WoW, appears to be in the early stages of creating their own undead dragonflight in Scholomance, which seems to indicate that the frost wyrms aren't part of it. Secondly, even if you DO categorize the Scourge's frost wyrms as a full-fledged flight, that doesn't mean that every undead dragon in the game is part of it. Three of the four dragons listed on this page aren't related to the Scourge in any way. They don't even all utilize frost breath; Nightbane breaths fire, for example. Basically, what I'm trying to get at is that this page needs some serious work if it's to even be kept at all. - Dark T Zeratul 07:00, 5 May 2007 (EDT)


 * The huge bulk of this flight is found entirely in Northrend, created by the Lich King from the bones of dead dragons on the frozen plains in the middle of that continent. The fact that both this and the Plague(d) Dragonflights are made by the Scourge does not make them the same flight - their origins are completely different, and the plagued hatchlings aren't actually undead, just sick and contagious. -- 07:23, 5 May 2007 (EDT)


 * Still, of the four dragons mentioned by name on the page and categorized as part of the Undead Dragonflight, three of them clearly don't belong. - Dark T Zeratul 07:41, 5 May 2007 (EDT)

...and the source of the term "undead dragonflight" originates from what source? I think I agree with Zeratul's initial post...Baggins

Teribus the Cursed although useing the frost wyrm model, was likely black because they were the only flight on Draenor.-- 19:58, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Could the white drakes be from this flight? also gamefiles includesa white dragonspawn and white drakonids, all extremely similar to blues...hmm--Gurluas 15:05, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Magma wyrms
according to the WOTLK beta the cult of the damned is rising black dragons bones in form of magma wyrms in obsidian shrine or maw of neltharion should these be added?--Ashbear160 (talk) 22:42, 9 August 2008 (UTC)

Types
I highly doubt that undead dragons are sorted by the flight they belonged in live. They are sorted by the act of reanimation. All dragons that died frozen in Northrend are Frostwyrms as said in the WC3 manual. Magmawyrms are simply still burning skeletons like Nightbane and the mobs found in the the obdidian shrine. Fel dragons are raised by fel magic. --LemonBaby (talk) 15:33, 3 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Magmawyrms and emberwyrms seem to be based on flight, as while magmawyrms make sense due to environmental factors, the red dragonshrine isn't burning.-- 19:19, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Nightbane is a blue dragon and a magmawyrm, so it might not based on flight. They are just skeletons of dragons. Frostwyrms are frozen, magmawyrms are burning. Simple is that. --LemonBaby (talk) 19:25, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Nightbane isn't necessarily a magmawyrm, just on fire.-- 19:34, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * He is a undead skeletal dragon on fire - just like the undead skeletal dragons at the obsidian shrine. Black dragons like Teribus the Cursed who are not on fire are not using the magmawyrm model. There are enought exceptions to say that their model does not represent their flight, it represents on what state they were raised (burning, frozen, fel, nothing special). --LemonBaby (talk) 19:40, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * It represents what state they were when they were raised, but I wonder if their nature at all adds to that. Why are the red dragons on fire? Were they cremated, or it is just their nature? Both are in-character for them, but the ruby shrine itself is not fire-based.-- 20:57, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * magmawyrms are on fire because they were in lava when they were raised. Nightbane is on fire because Medivh set him on fire. Emberwyrms are not burning at all, they are just a little smoldering... Sorry for my bad english again ;) --LemonBaby (talk) 21:39, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Well, why are they smoldering? The dragons that make them are burning a bit too.-- 21:45, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * As far as I remember Return to the Earth the Ruby Keepers are on fire while lying on the ground.--LemonBaby (talk) 22:22, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Yeah... why?-- 22:24, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I realy don't remember.. but if you check the pictures on wowhead of the quest you can see their burning corpes. So emberwyrms are burning skeletons because their corpes where burning when they were raised --LemonBaby (talk) 22:35, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I know they were burning. You say that emberwyrms come about due to environmental factors, not dragonflight, yet nothing around them is setting them on fire.-- 22:42, 4 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I found the reason ;-) First of all: This is the only case in which red dragons are on fire after their death, so no: it is not in the nature of the red dragons to burn after death. They died in the ruby dragonshrine because the emberwyrms set them on fire. You can actually see that in-game. Thats why they rained down burning and are raised burning. They are just like Smoldering Skeletons, but in their case nobody would argue that they were once a special kind of humanoids who always smolder after death, so all of them will become Smoldering Skeleletons after beeing raised ;-) --LemonBaby (talk) 07:29, 5 June 2012 (UTC)
 * So red dragons are only on fire at the dragonshrine, and only because the emberwyrms lit them on fire. Then who lit the emberwyrms on fire?-- 17:31, 5 June 2012 (UTC)
 * The red dragons in-game at the dragonshrine are on fire, because the emberwyrms set them in-game on fire, yes. That is clear. To say that every red dragon burns after his death and when it got raised it becomes this on-time mob called emberwyrm is realy far stretched in my opinion. I know your next question: Who set the first emberwyrms on fire? Because its unclear we can only speculate. Maybe the magmawyrms from the obsidian shrine did it. They were the first wave of dragons who attacked the red shrine. But as I said: it is only speculation, same as to say that all red dragons become emberwyrms.--LemonBaby (talk) 17:51, 5 June 2012 (UTC)
 * The shrine might cremate dragons that die in it. I don't know.-- 17:47, 9 June 2012 (UTC)

Update: The last magazine in Brann's journal on page 89 says "Different flights make different undead dragons" (regarding the three types). Maybe a bit of a retcon regarding frostwyrms, but it is confirmation.-- 03:33, 20 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Nice catch! Thank you! I need to get the last magazine someday....--LemonBaby (talk) 17:43, 22 June 2012 (UTC)