Talk:Zandali

Are trolls actually from Tatooine?
Anyone notice a resemblance with some of the Troll phrases from the .wav files to various alien languages from Star Wars? For example, I can clearly recall something very close to 'deeiwoniwonga' being said in Episode 1 by Gragra as well 'echuta' sounds like something I think Sebulba has said. If not, it totally sounds like a Jawa/Ewok word. --Magnus 14:06, 17 December 2006 (EST)

I have, here, this is what it is: -Achuta 'Hello' -Echuta a very insulting expletive used as a curseword, possibly tranlates as go to hell. -Koochoo 'idiot' I dont know about Deeiwoniwonga, but im glad to see that im not the only one who thought they sounded similar.--Klogger 00:23, 5 March 2007 (EST)


 * After recently watching Episodes IV-VI of Star Wars, I immediately recognized some of the "troll" words being used. For instance, in Episode V in Cloud City when C3PO wanders into the room where he is captured, a droid first comes out and says, "Echuta" and C3PO says, "How rude."  In Episode VI the advisor-type guy (I'm not a Star Wars buff so don't flog me for not knowing his race or name or anything) to Jabba the Hut says "deeiwoniwonga" and jabanobadapatoo".
 * Of course none of this is entirely surprising, as Blizzard includes Star Wars references quite frequently (Laando, Kessel Run, "All to easy", etc.) 06:54, 26 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I think most of the SW-like quotes are simply English phrases with an alien twist. This way "state your business!" resp. "say what you want!" becomes "Die wanna wanga!", and "idiot!" becomes "ichuta!". --Xorghul (talk) 07:51, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Shouldn't 'tastingo' be changed to 'tas'dingo'? I saw it spelled that way somewhere, and it looks closer to what Doctor Bom'bay and the Witch Doctors and Warcraft III trolls said. --Super Bhaal 01:12, 27 April 2007 (EDT)


 * It's apparently spelled using the file name spelling. I don't know for sure though.Baggins 01:15, 27 April 2007 (EDT)


 * I found that little list of file names on a very old thread when digging around on Google for info on Zandali for roleplay purposes. I can't for the life of me find the link to it now, and can't even find any monster/unit sound files in the WC3 folders with My Warcraft Studio (it may work for another program).  I could take the list out if you find it irrelevant, but considering I have heard words like "echuta" and "deeiwoniwonga" spoken in the game I'd say it is probably accurate.  06:54, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Someone should add vog sounds for those words to the wiki.Baggins 17:21, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

The 'Zul' Debate

 * It's stated in the RP part of the language that Zul simply means voodoo master. Take some of the names of the warcraft 3 shadow hunters for example, Zul'kis, Zul'abar, Zul'rajas, Zul'maran and some WoW trolls, Zul'Arek, Zul'Brin, Zul'Lor, Zul'Marosh and Zul'Jin and it looks like it just means cheiftain type figure.
 * There are around 8 Zul'... cities or villages that make no direct reference to a hero of the same name but when considering Sen'Jin village in southern Durotar was definitely named after the departed chief of the Darkspear Tribe I reason that Trolls have a habit of naming villages and cities after their great heroes.


 * I agree, there is a reason why that fan speculation is under "speculation" section.Baggins 23:35, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Updating the section
I added the word "Jin'rokh" after the item Jin'rohk, The Great Apocalypse. It seems that "rohk" have "destructive" or "anhilitating" connotations since Jin'rokh the Breaker also shares the same word, like the English word for "thrashing". I hope you don't mind if I add it :) -- Ravenore, the Necroshadowmancer 18:17, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh dear, I found out that is spelled "Rohk" not "Rokh". I'm correcting it! Sorry! Still is curious why changing a letter from place can change the whole concept of a word :S I wonder if it is a typo from Blizzard's programmers. -- Ravenore, the Necroshadowmancer 18:25, 27 October 2007 (UTC)


 * It seems obvious that "Jin'Rohk" doesn't mean "The Great Apocalypse" since, we know "jin" means "tribal chief or elder" officially. I don't think that a weapon's title is the definition of a weapon's name, just a longer nickname for the weapon, based on the notierity it received. In this case I think the weapon was probably named after the person who probably wielded it, but the weapon gained the notierty of causing alot of bloodshed. But thanks for leaving your speculation in the speculations section.Baggins 18:27, 27 October 2007 (UTC)


 * I thought for objects it could meant "great", or at least like to rank label that object as "the big boss" of its kind. At least, that makes sense for me, since, for example, the big daddy of the Colts is the Walker Colt, so, I would label that Colt as a the "Jin" of the Colts, or the "Big Boss", if you understand my point about why for me the Jin'Rohk could be more apt to be the name of the weapon rather than the name of its last wielder (from who supposadly Zul'Jin may be inherited it or stole it).
 * PS: I love speculation section, heheh. -- Ravenore, the Necroshadowmancer 17:42, 5 November 2007 (UTC)


 * We only know the jungle troll definition in the context of naming conventions in the jungle troll dialect of Zandali. That is " 'jin " can mean, "tribal chief", "elder", "tribal" or "great tribal" in jungle troll culture's definitions and naming convention. We do not know if it works the same way in other cultures. In Jin'rohk we have a different issue as it is a prefix rather than a suffice. We do not know what jin means in the context of a "prefix", nor would we know what it means in the context of an infix either. Remember when it comes to linguistics you have to take dialects into account. Also linguistically languages don't always follow English grammatical and linguistical system. To apply an English format (I.E. a language translating word for word in a linear order) is generally a grave mistake in linguistical studies.Baggins 17:03, 20 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Jin'Rohk, Jin means "Great" (probably), and Rohk, is an obvious "Ragnarök" --Teonod (talk) 07:01, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

Tribal names
Saying that a word is possibly of "African" origin is pretty much the same as saying a word is of "European" origin. Europe contains French, Spanish, English, Russian and a couple dozen other unrelated languages. It's a sweeping generalisation that basically equates all of the hundreds of African languages as being pretty much the same. I can't blame the last poster, since the dictionary he or she used is probably what limited him or her, but I replaced the generalisation with something more specific.

Kadir Silvermace 20:58, 10 January 2008 (UTC)

"Ziggy Zoggy Ziggy Zoggy Oy Oy Oy" is what is chanted on the Man Show right before they chug beer. If this is in Warcraft somehow, it is simpyl a reference that. That begs me to ask why it is included in at list of Zandali words. It was added by Baggins on Dec. 21.

Its troll drinking chant during Beerfest, in game. As such it represents troll speech pattern with no translation. Although its an pop reference too.Baggins (talk) 10:55, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

En Fuego
Yes, its bad spanish. But its also a word that troll bat riders speak in Warcraft III, and no other race, whenever they take orders (not a click joke). It can be added for that for that reason alone. Its no more different than the list of star wars language terms that are on the list. They are on the list because they were used exclusively by trolls in the warcraft II. Not as click sounds but as order acknowledgement sounds.

In addition this is another reason Deo Gracias is in the Common article because the sound is played exclusively in a human building.

Spanish and latin are not "official warcraft languages" therefore any words that may be derived from in-game races must be connected to those race languages instead, not real languages that do not exist in the universe.

Its been confirmed that for the case of Common some of the words definitely originate from real world languages. Some of the Dwarven words have old english or german background as well.

Finally remember neutral point of view does not allow for "opinions" of something based on aesthetic values. If we think its bad or silly that has no bearing on inclusions into articles as long as it is cited it is viable to be listed. The sound effect fits better here than anywhere else.Baggins (talk) 13:14, 21 May 2008 (UTC)


 * No, it'd rather fit right into the troll batrider's W3 page. And nowhere else. Troll batriders don't ever say "en feugo" nor "en fuego" nor any words alike in non-English Warcraft III copies, so I assume this was meant to be a joke aimed at Spanish speaking players?-- K )  (talk) 16:59, 21 May 2008 (UTC)


 * It is too in the American english version the game (I have edition released in America). I can rip the sound if you like when I have the time. I know this because I was the one who added that reference around the same time I added the naga siren words to nazja article. I honestly wonder how the trolls' jamaican/latin islanders accent/pidjin even directly translates into other languages...?
 * Also the word also fits well here for not being not being "english" and being used by trolls. Opinions on if its a joke or not withstanding have no merit in the neutral point of view.Baggins (talk) 01:14, 22 May 2008 (UTC)


 * What? Of course it's in the American version as well, "English Warcraft III copies" means English-speaking games, thought you'd get that. I don't care whether or not it's a joke, I'm just saying that if a random unit uses a phrase in a language that already exists, by no means it should be considered as a vernacular expression. Also I'd like to point out that your say implying that "trolls" use the "word". This is way too general an overview. Those two words haven't been used by all Trolls, but barely a type of unit in Wacraft III, whose principle is to entertain the player with funny sounds. All that stuff is piling up, man, to make a steamy argument against it. Or maybe we should add the Silly template to this page? =)-- K )  (talk) 14:40, 22 May 2008 (UTC)


 * You seem to be unclear on the purpose of the silly template its to only to be used for stuff that doesn't originate from Blizzard sources (I.E. the games, rpg, the books, etc). Again, the term is used much in the same way that Osh'bala-tharei is used by siren, as one of the acknowledgement sound when sent out to attack something. Its a bit different than the multiclick jokes. As only a troll unit says it, and its not part of Common vernacular, or dwarven, or any of the other languages, troll language is the closest article it can fit into (well it could possibly a "low common" phrase). At least until "Spanish" is established as an official language (although spaniards do seem to exist, thinks of all the "Dons" mentioned in the MMO). To be honest alot of words in warcraft games were to be silly, "zug zug" was created to be funny word. Most of the troll sounds from WArcraft II came right out of Star Wars. The troll drinking chant in WoW is right out hte Man Show. If you think it is silly or not doesn't matter, because it originated from an official source is all that counts here... Neutral point of view is taken.Baggins (talk) 16:34, 22 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Yes to neutral point of view, no to dumb point of view... Language jokes do not apply for stuff that have to be taken seriously. "En fuego" already exists in Spanish, I still stand against this assumption.-- K )  (talk) 17:45, 22 May 2008 (UTC)


 * What's that now? Gourra takes the phrase off and you don't lift a finger?-- K )  (talk) 21:35, 12 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Strangely no one seems to have a problem with the star wars sayings, which may certainly be click jokes. Hipocracy... In anycase I've moved the info over to Haliscan, since it likely relates more to that than here.Baggins (talk) 09:23, 19 June 2008 (UTC)
 * What Star Wars sayings are you talking about? 09:26, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

Trolls, Zandali, Low Common and Common
On Yojamba Isle there is a conversation between a "Servitor of Rastakhan" from the Zandalar Tribe and a captured Hakkari zealot. The Zandalar starts interrogating him in Zandali ([Troll] ingame), the Hakkari then answers (in the sort of Common readable to all PCs), "Curious, a servitor of Rastakhan that does not know that the Hakkari don't converse in the old tongue.", so they seem to speak just Common, perhaps abandoned Zandali for religious reasons? --Hurax (talk) 15:50, 19 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Perhaps he's one of the trolls who "decended so far into barbarism, forgetting the langage".Baggins (talk) 19:06, 19 June 2008 (UTC)

Renewed 'Zul' Debate
Mordecay, I'd argue that non-functioning reference links are invalid to use as references, because even if it might've been used in the past, it's pretty much redundant now that it's gone.

Not to mention, the second reference attached to the word was from RPG, which wouldn't strengthen the validity. And should be removed as a reference, at least. Though I'd still say the dead link count as an invalid source.

If Lore were to post a new tweet or Q&A about Zul meaning "Voodoo Master" (which I very much am still against), then sure, that would definitely be enough. But.. since the link is removed, and whatever was said on it is gone.. So is the validity, in my opinion. WarGodZajru (talk) 14:13, 16 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Why not just keep both information? Xporc (talk) 14:54, 16 February 2017 (UTC)


 * The issue is that an RPG reference is listed in the canon dictionary, RPG isn't canon, so it should be excluded to the RPG section. In regards to Lore's tweet, I mean, I don't see the point in keeping it. No one will be able to see what he said.
 * If you mean Zul meaning both Voodoo Master & Great, then uh, sure, doesn't make much sense for it to mean Voodoo Master though, not sure where that came from. WarGodZajru (talk) 14:57, 16 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Just because the twitter account was deleted, doesn't make what he said non-canon. it's worth keeping a mention.Xporc (talk) 15:12, 16 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Yep, we can no longer see what exactly Loreology said, but in general wowpedia hasn't been deleting all info that originate from his tweets (the "dead link" tag is added tho).
 * Also, what makes u think Zul could mean "Great"? --Mordecay (talk) 15:18, 16 February 2017 (UTC)


 * Well, still can't say I share that mindset though. There's not really much to.. mention about it. But, I'll leave it as is then. Conflicting opinions is all.
 * Not to mention, it makes a lot more sense that Zul would mean "great" rather than "voodoo master", considering how the word is used. Zul'Gurub, Zul'Aman, Zul'Drak, Voodoo master Gurub? Errh.. Doesn't sound logical. Zul'jin was never really one for voodoo, either. So suddenly calling him a Voodoo master leader makes no sense what-so-ever, he's always been a warrior-type of character. WarGodZajru (talk) 15:28, 16 February 2017 (UTC)
 * Meh, languages can be weird. Like how "boner" can be a joke or an erection. I don't see the point of removing canon information to replace it by what "makes a lot more sense to WarGodZajru" : / Xporc (talk) 15:30, 16 February 2017 (UTC)

I seriously can't help but say something about this... again. This time I don't care about the link to Loreology's tweet not working but.. come on.

Zul'Gurub isn't "Voodoo Master Gurub" nor is Zul'Aman, or Zul'Drak It's loosely translated to "Great Gurub, Great Aman, Great Drak", they're capitals, not.. not voodoo masters...

I get context can be a thing (Zul'Malacrass (lmao) being "Voodoo Master Malacrass" since he dabbles with voodoo, Zul'Gurub being "Great Gurub", Zul'jin being "Great Leader", but really, Loreology did a stoopid when it came to that tweet. He must've looked at the RPG and not really considered previous uses of the prefix. Zul'jin isn't a user of voodoo either, he loves his endlessly respawning axes.

...yes it really bothers me that it has fully replaced "great". ;_; WarGodZajru (talk) 07:53, 9 April 2017 (UTC)


 * Other examples of context though, since I am sure that would be a working solution.
 * Empire of Zul: Was the greatest empire at the time.
 * Dark Prophet Zul: A troll mystic, whom most likely dabbles with voodoo.
 * Altar of Zul: May be an altar to voodoo users, so, "Altar of Voodoo Masters".
 * WarGodZajru (talk) 08:02, 9 April 2017 (UTC)


 * We already had this discussion. "Voodoo Master" and "Chief" is the same word, that's all. Not every language will conform to western logic, and there are often languages where several unrelated concepts are named with the same word.Xporc (talk) 08:32, 9 April 2017 (UTC)


 * Yes, yes we did, though it kept bothering me... it hurts me when I see it. I am far from a fan of the current denotation of "Voodoo Master", though where did chief come in? What does western logic have to do with this? Let's name our capitals "Voodoo Master" now, "Voodoo Master London", sounds like a great plan. Though I agree with the latter, hence why I brought up examples of various contexts of where it would be used as a prefix for the term "great" or, heck, Zul' when tied to a city name could even denote it being a capital. Prefix =/= as a separate word (all the time) as well. Nonetheless, that's true. I'll uh, try and not look at "Zul'"s "translation" when next I visit the page.. Buuut, trying to see logic won't do much when there's a broken reference telling me otherwise... :c
 * Should at least have multiple meanings.... maybe one day..
 * Am sorry if passive-aggressiveness is elevated, I haven't slept yet.. I get weird. WarGodZajru (talk) 08:51, 9 April 2017 (UTC)