Talk:Teron Gorefiend

Why is he in the Black Temple?
In Warcraft II Teron Gorefiend is allied with Ner'zhul, now the Lich King fusion of Ner'zhul/Arthas. Yet why has he taken refuge inside the Black Temple? This is Illidan's domain, and as far as I know, Illidan and The Lich King are bitter enemies. (Illidan tried to destroy the Lich King in Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne.) Dazgodbold 15:17, 22 May 2007 (UTC)


 * he was more loyal to Gul'Dan, but he will ally with whoever is in power.-- 21:58, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I'd like to press this matter as people like to add it: It is not possible to Teron to "sneak back to the Black Temple, after the Alliance left Fortress Shadowmoon's ruins, at the end of the second war", as he in this quest possesses your body to defeat his captor, then afterwards rides from the altar to presumably the Black Temple, where he now resides. The reason to why he's there, though, is mysterious, and it may just be because he allies with whoever is in power of the temple (see above).-- 17:51, 6 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Teron Gorefiend was a servant of Gul'dan, and then a servant of Ner'zhul when Gul'dan died... But his primary master has always been himself. Keep in mind also that not only has he been dead for twenty years but he also hasn't seen Ner'zhul in that time.  It's likely that upon returning to life he formed an alliance with the closest person in a position of power, which was Illidan Stormrage. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 20:32, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Burning Crusade
Teron Gorefiend is guarding Ner'zhul's Inner Sanctum in the Heart of Evil, and he can be slain by the Alliance. This directly contradicts the theory that he is the Lord the Black Riders mentioned. --Shalkis 02:33, 29 May 2006 (EDT)
 * That doesn't mean anything. You also kill Deathwing in an Alliance mission, but he's certainly still around. --Mikaka 13:40, 13 November 2006 (EST)

At this point it is canon. He and his death knights returned after the Second War to Draenor and committed ritual suicide, so they cannot be the same riders in Azeroth.

And Deathwing is not even in the game.--Grid 02:18, 5 December 2006 (EST)


 * Huh? Committed suicide? "Gorefiend killed himself over grief that his friend and master Gul'dan died"? What the heck is the source on that? I have a hard time believing someone as evil as Gorefiend would kill himself over the death of a friend, especially considerably after the fact. The article says that he returned to Draenor after the second war and killed himself. But it wasn't until after the second war (Beyond the Dark Portal is considered post-Second War) that Gorefiend even entered Warcraft lore.


 * Besides, Teron is alive and in Shadowmoon Valley. --Mikaka 21:39, 9 December 2006 (EST)

The Dark Portal campaign IS considered part of the second war, and we have our proof via WorldofRaids and the beta players who have done the quest line with him. He explains what happened and like it or not, he KILLED himself over the death of his master and friend Gul'Dan. He is not "alive and well". The entire quest is about helping him gain a corporeal body back.--Grid 07:41, 18 December 2006 (EST)

Well since it is just one small mission you cannot really assume Teron is dead - there are many changes to the story since Warcraft 2; just take for example, that you kill Gul'dan yourself in Warcraft 2, but we all know that he was torn apart by crazed demons within the Tomb of Sargeras.

Quest
The final note in the end about returning to the questgiver; upon completion I did not receive nor do any quest to 'kill' Teron Gorefiend. Freeing him and killing his "warden" was enough to complete the chain and get the rewards. --Urskin 15:29, 21 February 2007 (EST)


 * You're right, there's no quest, but the npc gets pissed that you freed him (even though wasn't intentional) and tells you to use the items that you get from completing the chain to track him down and kill him in plain text. Xlel 21:15, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Warlock or Necrolyte?
I don't have my War2 manual handy, but I believe that the Death Knight (Warcraft II) article is correct, and that the death knights were created from spirits of the warlocks:
 * Gul'dan imbued the souls of the most powerful of the fallen warlocks into the corpses of the fallen knights of Stormwind. The necromantic magics of the slain necrolytes were imbued into jeweled truncheons which served to focus the newly-risen death knights' powers.--Aeleas 11:25, 18 December 2006 (EST)


 * I recall the manual describing the truncheons, but I don't think is specified warlocks as part of the mix. I'm separated from my copy at the moment, so I can't quote.--Ragestorm 11:29, 18 December 2006 (EST)


 * We have it here: The History of Orcish Ascension. The above quote reflects the manual's text.--Aeleas 11:51, 18 December 2006 (EST)


 * Well, it doesn't mention warlocks specifically, it just says "Shadow Council," which included necrolytes, warlocks, ogre-magi, and even cheiftains (Kargeth Bladefist and Cho'gall were also members). I also think that the BtDP manual said something like "the ancient Orcish spirirt of Gorefiend lives within the carcass of an Azerothian knight." You're right, though: calling him a necrolyte is perhaps erroneus. Change it to "member of the Shadow Council"?--Ragestorm 13:50, 18 December 2006 (EST)


 * I think it's clear from the context that the members being referred to are the warlocks executed a couple of paragraphs earlier, but "member of the Shadow Council" works too.--Aeleas 18:25, 18 December 2006 (EST)

Necrolyte
According to Blizzard's latest lore article concerning the death knight (http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/wrath/features/deathknight/lore.xml), Teron Gorefiend was a Necrolyte during the First War. The only mention of warlocks in the article is that Doomhammer crushed "the orc warlocks of the Shadow Council," and that the only warlock he spares is Gul'dan. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by.

Warlock
In Tides of Darkness page 94, when Gul'dan "welcomes" Gorefiend back into the world, Doomhammer says, and I quote (bolded the main point for emphasis): "Gorefiend? One of your warlocks from the Shadow Council? I killed him myself." Either Doomhammer was ignorant of the distinction between warlock magic and necromancy (not that I blame him, both are considered "evil"), or maybe there's a bit of confusion as to what exactly Gorefiend was. Now I am aware that Blizzard's official info usually countermands things from the books, but I figured I would throw that out there. --Joshmaul 10:39, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

I think he was a necrolyte for 2 reasons 1 The Death Knight lore came after the novel. 2 The lore was from a official point of view, the novel was just from Doomhammer's own Pov. Doomhammer certainly could be wrong since he did not know much about magic.Master3 17:15, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

New model!?
Look what I found. It seems that Blizzard will be changing the model in the next patch. http://img442.imageshack.us/my.php?image=gorefiendrz8.jpg Regards, --Theron the Just 13:48, 19 April 2007 (EDT)


 * ...Old news, :).Baggins 13:59, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

No need to be so rude. It is a bit hard for me to know what you know. Regards, --Theron the Just 14:24, 19 April 2007 (EDT)


 * Whose being rude? Not I. I was just letting you know that graphic change has already come up in several articles.Baggins 14:26, 19 April 2007 (EDT)


 * Anyway, if someone could find an in-game shot of him and add it to the article, that would be great :) 15:02, 19 April 2007 (EDT)

????
WTF is Teron doing in outland? if i recall, he was at azheroth —The preceding unsigned comment was added by.

What is "azheroth"? Sign your posts. And to answer your question: Gorefiend went back to Draenor after the Second War to serve Ner'zhul, the new Warchief.--Odolwa 16:17, 31 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Well actually Teron Gorefiend was collecting a couple of the pieces needed to open the portals back on Draenor in Beyond the Dark Portal, and took them back to Draenor to give to Ner'zhul so he could open the portals.Baggins 16:39, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

Does he serve Illidan?
Seems to me is more working with Illidan than working for him. In his own words, he's been gone along time, and "has a lot of catching up to do". He probably planned his work with Illidan to be a temporary thing after he got his body back, so he could gather some power to himself and assess the world situation, which is drasticly different from when he died. Granted, thats just speculation, but seems as likely, if not more likely, than him suddenly taking orders from Illidan.Tweak the Whacked 18:14, 12 December 2007 (UTC)

Glitch
I found him, and attempted to kill karsius (more than 5 times =/)) even if u kill him, i love the wisp btw, if someone kills your low-hp spirit...boom...stuck as gorefiend. I did this 2.1 prior, and I got stuck as Gorefiend forever. No joke. The bar ran out and nothing, still Gorefiend. I walked to SMV hold...or w/e it's called. I walked in, and I could talk to people, it was like world of warcraft 2, and u cud be any one with any faction. I could also see any ghosts, and the ghostriders of karabor: nothing. they didnt attack me, and i walked right through them. life was good, till the GM told me to do something, which I was forced to anyways. good times. ANARCHY NOW! lol...don't you also love how you get to kill almost all the wc2 heroes, or possible to? TirisfalMage 17:54, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Gorefiend
Not a really important question but... is Gorefiend really the surname of Teron? Or he just forsaked his real one when he became warlock? I just want to know this out of curiosity.(Duke Ragereaver 06:53, 28 February 2008 (UTC))


 * I'd have to check the excact text (Tides of Darkness holds the most recent version), but it is either real or a title he assumed. -- Ragestorm (talk &middot; contr) 04:46, 28 February 2008 (UTC)


 * ToD just calls him Teron Gorefiend also. Since even Doomhammer called him that I would assume its his name since I doubt he would be privy to the name if it was just a title. Leviathon 04:51, 28 February 2008 (UTC)

Considering that orcish surnames are taken from accomplishments of either that orc or his ancestor, and many orc lines don't even have surnames, I'd believe that Gorefiend is an actual name he gained, he definately earned it a dozen times over, even before he became a death knight.Tweak the Whacked 23:25, 17 March 2008 (UTC)

Wings?
Havent seen anyone wonder where he suddenly got his wings from? TherasTaneel (talk) 00:34, 2 January 2009 (UTC)

Just a guess, but maybe he had some warlock-like powers that allowed him to get them. In recent patches warlocks can now turn into demons and wing designs look similar. Maybe he learned a little after studying under Gul'dan and was able to partially become a demon. Or Blizzard could have just put it there for the heck of it to make him look cooler. jclipps (talk) 21:58, 3 January 2009 (UTC)

Dead according to lore
i think it is safe to assume that he is now officially dead (again) due to the fact that Illidan is now dead. bye, Teron, it was nice knowing ya.Gargar (talk) 23:50, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

Why reedit it back to only killable? his master is officially dead. we killed Terron and the rest of the bosses when we raided Black Temple. he's not such a prominent lore figure so chances for us to ever get an official statement from Blizzard are slime.Gargar (talk) 09:20, 29 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Characters killed by players in WoW are to be listed as "Killable" regardless of circumstances. - from Template:Npcbox. Bosses are listed as Deceased (lore) only if they are actualy deceased in the lore (redundant no?). Player actions are not lore, statements from an official source are. Like Onyxia killed by Varian, or Nefarian stated as dead by Sinestra. 11:22, 29 January 2009 (UTC)


 * not true. the only example of what you're saying is Onyxia. which i think should be considered as a retcon on Blizzard's part. player actions ARE lore. let's look at the wotlk manual. about Kael'thas "Rather than see the prince's plan reach fruition, Out'and's heros defeated him" next about Illidan "they began by overcoming one of Illidan's top lieutenants, the naga witch Lady Vashj. the emboldened fighters then stormed the gates of the Black Temple and confronted Illidan himself, ultimately killed the Betrayer" it goes on and o about Zul'jin and Kil'jaden.


 * also, about Nefarian, he wasn't killed by lady Sinestra. she implies from him being dead but nothing else about this is ever written anywehere including day of the dragon. the only example of what you're saying is onyxia... which should be a retconGargar (talk) 12:39, 29 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Not true. A retcon is a change to lore that directly contradicts previously established information. If previous sources state the Onyxia was killed by the generic "heroes" or "adventurers", well she was- I'd say that Varian and the others count as heroes of Azeroth. I have never supported the "deceased (lore)/killable(WoW)" thing. As far as I'm concerned, they're "Killable" until/unless they are removed from the game. "Killable" therefore means, "can be killed by players, but are almost certainly dead according to lore."-- Ragestorm  (talk &middot; contr) 13:51, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

onyxia is decreased according to lore because she was slain in comic. in wow players killed him, in lore, varian did. teron is (killable) until it is confirmed. Noobi666 (talk) 14:04, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

Teron, Power hungry?
Would anyone suggest Teron Gorefiend is power hungry and thats why he pretty much joined with Illidan? (Zelaroth 01:08, January 6, 2010 (UTC))
 * While it's fairly accepted that he was power hungry, there's unfortunately nothing concrete with regards to why he joined Illidan. In the end, it's just yet another speculation. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 23:03, January 5, 2010 (UTC)

Would you say he's power hungry enough to have betrayed Gul'dan? If power was offered to him in the Second War (Zelaroth 01:08, January 6, 2010 (UTC))
 * Sign your posts please. Who knows, it's one of those things can't be guessed at with any real certainty. 00:10, January 6, 2010 (UTC)

Shadowmoon Chieftain
I'm looking at the succession box, and I'm very confused. How does he fit BETWEEN Magtheridon and Keli'dan the Breaker as chieftain? Since he was already dead when Illidan conquered Outland, shouldn't he have come either before Magtheridon or after Keli'dan? -- Dark T Zeratul (talk)
 * Yeah, that is very confusing. Besides, I don't see anything that hint of Keli'dan as being the leader of the Shadowmoon clan. Benitoperezgaldos (talk) 16:53, March 23, 2010 (UTC)

I've never heard anything about Teron Gorefiend being the Chieftain of the Shadowmoon Clan. So can someone show me the source that revealed Gorefiend as the Shadowmoon Chieftain? --Sairez (talk)

Truncheon
I brought this up on another talk page, but to reiterate it. Duke Vallenhal has the same truncheon as Gorefiend. A Guldanian Death Knight in the service of the Lich King, yet not a Lich? Furthermore, I cant find any indication that Guldanian Death Knights became Liches. Khorne25 (talk) 18:11, April 14, 2010 (UTC)
 * For the first, I suspect it's purely a matter of reusing the weapon graphic. For the second, it says in the Warcraft 3 manual that and whatever followers of Ner'zhul were with him when he was captured by Kil'jaeden were transformed into liches. I believe it specifies that some were death knights, but even if it doesn't it can certainly be inferred. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 18:42, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Guile of Gorefiend
It is strange there should be a Death Knight talent named after him in the Frost tree, after all Gorefiend has never been recorded using frost magic. It could be that the increased crit damage and longer Icebound Fortitude is 'insidious' to the level of Gorefiend but to me the name of the talent seems to indicate that these enhancements were pioneered by Gorefiend. Khorne25 (talk) 18:11, April 14, 2010 (UTC)
 * A lot of the death knight talents are named after famous death knights, regardless of what they actually did. This is especially amusing with Gorefiend, too, considering the death knights of the Horde differ in all but name from the death knights of the Scourge. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 18:39, April 14, 2010 (UTC)

Who?
Any one know whos body is it? His soul is of an orc, but the body is of a fallen human knight.--JVS (talk) 17:21, September 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Nobody knows exactly who's body it is. It is not stated anywhere by Blizzard except that it is of a human knight, so it could be any Azeroth human knight. [[Image:IconSmall_Sheep.gif]] Me! (Am I in trouble? What did I do?) 18:04, September 29, 2010 (UTC)

His Weapon
Anyone have and idea or clue what his weapon is, or what it is called, or any backstory about it? It seems to be a unique mace or staff but there is very little else to go on...--Imagination fuels creativity. Censorship fuels ignorance. (talk) 23:56, October 11, 2010 (UTC)
 * His weapon is the same as all of Gul'dan's death knights: a jeweled truncheon infused with the soul of the orc necrolyte sacrificed to restore him to life. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 00:40, October 12, 2010 (UTC)
 * I think Andreioplst is talking about the appearance of his weapon in World of Warcraft. I do not know what it is called, or if it drops anywhere.-- 19:07, October 12, 2010 (UTC)

It's a truncheon, all Death Knights of the old Horde were given one, i know for sure that it's called a truncheon, which is a short staff/spear without head. (This next part i'm not one hundred percent sure on, but the basics are there) Gul'dan killed his necrolytes, carved their hearts out and fused their necrotic powers to them, which was given to every Death Knight to bolster their warlock abilities with necromancy. The weapon itself is of no importance, it's the heart/orb with the necrotic energy that matters, and we can clearly see it in that mace/sword-thingie he's currently wielding. --Quetzatoul (talk) 18:36, 16 January 2011 (UTC)

Race?
I don't have the book at hand but I highly doubt that it says that Death knight is a race. If so there should be a Death knight (race) page.--LemonBaby (talk) 14:39, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
 * You are right, it does not mention them as a race, but neither does it mention them as a class. This line opts me to believe that it indicates that they are a race (at least that's how I interpreted it since it does not mention them by classes, i.e. warlocks, shamans, warriors, death knights and others but instead says orcs, death knights and others which leads me to believe that they are a race) "By this time a large number of orcs, death knights, and others had fled through the portal rather than face death or capture." Take that as you will, if you still think that they are not a race feel free to re-revert and I won't change it again. -[[File:CogHammer.gif]]D oo meЯ  T [[Image:Battlegroup_RoundIcon.png|16px]]C  14:49, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Nope, that is not enough in my opinion.--LemonBaby (talk) 18:38, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
 * May you enlighten me on why you think it is not enough? I'd like to know what you think to see where I was wrong. -[[File:CogHammer.gif]]D oo meЯ  T [[Image:Battlegroup_RoundIcon.png|16px]]C  18:42, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Death knights are as much a state of being as they are a class. Their 'racial properties' are that they are undead and death knights. I don't think there is enough for a page.-- 19:17, 14 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Very well, an admin's word is final. Thanks for your time. -[[File:CogHammer.gif]]D oo meЯ  T [[Image:Battlegroup_RoundIcon.png|16px]]C  19:21, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

Teron'gor
Is there evidence for this version of Teron Gorefiend ever being known as "Teron'gor"? It seems like that could be a difference between the timelines (one that existed even before Garrosh and Kairoz began tampering with things). In Tides of Darkness, Orgrim Doomhammer recognized the name "Gorefiend" as belonging to a Shadow Council warlock.
 * "Welcome back, Teron Gorefiend," Gul’dan replied, trying to keep the laughter from his voice. "Yes, I have brought you back, to further serve the Horde."
 * Doomhammer stepped forward, studying the strange creature before him. "Gorefiend? One of your warlocks from the Shadow Council? I killed him myself."

It's not like "Gorefiend" would have been a particularly strange name for a living orc when you had people like "Bladefist", "Doomhammer", and "Hellscream" running around... Egrem (talk) 18:30, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * So far, the name Teron'gor appeared only in WoD. It's probably a difference or a retcon.--Mordecay (talk) 18:41, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Kosak certainly talked like Gorefiend's original name was Teron'gor: "At this point in history, Teron is known as Teron Gore[misspelling is transcription error] -- he's not Gorefiend yet." --Aquamonkeyeg (talk) 19:35, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I'd agree with it likely being a retcon. Most other stuff is. ReignTG (talk) 21:53, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure Kosak's comment about AU Teron is applicable to MU Teron, since there's evidence to the contrary (ToD) and we know the timelines weren't identical to begin with (ie. Golka not having a child, Rulkan not being dead, Tharbek being a Warsong instead of a Blackrock, etc). Egrem (talk) 22:33, 17 October 2014 (UTC)

Status unknown
I believe his status is listed as "unknown" because of his quotes. He says that the wheel of death has spun many times for him. Upon his defeat he says "The wheel... spins... again..." As for his title, IDK if it's actually been used as a title, but he says he was the first. --Aquamonkeyeg (talk) 19:16, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Yep, he was the first death knight. Checked BtDP novel and it wasn't used as a title there. So maybe move it to occupation line?--Mordecay (talk) 20:39, 17 August 2015 (UTC)
 * Having death knight as his class and "first death knight" as his occupation would be redundant. Besides, it already says he's the first in his introduction. -- Dark T Zeratul (talk) 21:05, 17 August 2015 (UTC)

I left this on Mordecay's talk page, but leaving it here as well for purposes of the subject.
 * Re: status unknown


 * Two possible reasons:
 * It may be vestigial information from prior to the first WoW expansion.
 * It was marked as unknown lore-wise because of the boss' death emote, which had him implying that he would eventually rise again.


 * Whichever is the case, it sounds speculative and, in my opinion, should be removed from the infobox and placed as a short note under the section for The Black Temple. -- Alayea (talk / contrib) 19:39, 17 August 2015 (UTC)