Forum:Apologizing to WoWWiki

Forums: Village pump → Apologizing to WoWWiki

Over on the other site, I recently came across their discussion from six months ago about migrating all editing effort to Wowpedia. I can see that discussion didn't really end conclusively, and its very evident that interpersonal conflcit is part of the problem.

I feel like we here on Wowpedia should reflect on our own contribution to the history of interpersonal conflict.

I don't want to point fingers and start a game of blaming individuals for specific grievances. And I realize there are folks here with tens/hundreds of thousands of edits wondering "who's this guy?" (Answer: a casual contributor since before the fork.).

But I feel we ought to reflect collectively on how we could build a better relationship with editors at WoWWiki. If nothing else, because having hurt feelings hang over our own past means we are not doing the best we can to be a welcoming environment as we ought to be.

I therefore suggest we should adopt something like the following:

1.	As the community of Wowpedia:

	a.	we recognize the volunteer contributions of editors on WoWWiki since our fork and applaud their sincere desire to build a better wiki just like we, too, wish to build a better wiki;

	b.	we recognize that at times we as a community have sometimes fallen short -- saying things that can hurt feeling and even acting confrontational toward WoWWiki when we could have been kinder; and

	c.	we recognize our own responsibility to make Wowpedia feel welcoming to everyone, including to editors of other wikis such as WoWWiki.


2 .	Therefore:

	a.	we express to all WoWWiki users and administrators that we are sorry for the harm caused at an individual, human level by our actions and words;
	
	b.	we affirm our continued desire to build Wowpedia, but with renewed effort to be kind and respectful in our treatment of others; and
	
	c.	we affirm no user should ever feel discouraged from editing multiple wikis, including WoWWiki and Wowpedia.

--DDC (talk) 05:54, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

how would we go about doing these things? i do think it’s admirable to want to mend the relationship between the wikis, but personally, as a newer editor i tend to feel like an outsider to the issue. i’ve never even personally spoken to any wowwiki editors; what could someone like me say? —Eithris (talk) 16:56, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

Most editors here never even knew wowwiki... Xporc (talk) 19:11, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

@Xporc: Its true, I'm writing in part about an event in the past. But its healthy for a community in the present moment to say "we're sorry you feel hurt" to someone who is aggrieved over the past. It's not about saying we are personally responsible, but about saying as a community that we all want to aspire to be the best we can be and that means being welcoming and friendly to everyone whether or not they recall the events of ten years ago.

@Eithris: As for "how", I would suggest something simple like a vote on whether or not the community does indeed believe these statements are valid (after some ammendments, of course). Saying we want to be welcoming and respectful isn't an actual change in policy so it wouldn't practically change anything... really we would just add a sentence to the about us page mentioning the vote took place right after the three or four sentences that already talk about the split. Beyond that, nothing more needs to be done -- except having fun making wiki contributions of course! DDC (talk) 23:36, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

And now this gem a couple months later...

“The wowwiki community has no strength or energy to contribute. Who's even here? Spambots and one literally insane admin refusing to let go of their kingdom of garbage, frothing at the mouth about some ancient grudge.”

— a FANDOM user on Crossover between WoWWiki and Wowpedia

This is why I wrote this thread. Its also why I wrote Forum:Vandalising WoWWiki years ago on both sites. As long as we don't respect WoWWikians as people as having the same volunteer spirit that we do, and just dismiss them as "at best, misinformed" to be left alone and "die at peace"... well, lets face it. WoWWiki will continue indefinitely under that status and continute to attract energy, new users who its frankly unfortunate arn't here.

Frankly, I think we, Wowpedia, have for ten years done a terrible job being truly welcoming to everyone who wants to edit a wiki about Warcraft. And until we look in the mirror and recognize that fact, we are a community that is broken, divided.

I'm just a nobody. Its honestly time for more important people than me to go out of their comfort zone and past grudges, and make it easier for people at WoWWiki to do the same. DDC (talk) 16:23, 15 February 2020 (UTC)

oof. that is... quite a post. i mean, i'm not always a fan of the way fandyllic does or says things, but i do understand and sympathize with his desire to protect something he worked really hard on. he doesn't deserve to be personally attacked for that—or, well, in general

(and for the sake of transparency, yes, i have been pretty critical of him in the past on more private channels. but over time i've lost a lot of the "grr argh, we're enemies" view and realized he's just a dude doing his own thing. he just lacks tact sometimes. we probably all do) —Eithris (talk) 16:50, 15 February 2020 (UTC)

Looking at my own history ten years later.... "we probably all do" is absolutely correct. Everyone's been guilty of being rough at the edges at some point, including myself. That's why I'm (hopefully not naively) trying to mend bridges between the two subcommunities. DDC (talk) 17:17, 15 February 2020 (UTC)

I don't think many here have an active disdain for WoWWiki and its users. Given the time frame, I reckon that past grievances are just that for most... In the past. Any well-meaning editor is welcome here the way I see it. PeterWind (talk) 17:56, 15 February 2020 (UTC)

I agree. It was a decade ago and we're all different people now. But it's hard to one-sidedly try to bury the hatchet. And I don't think it hurts us to enact Ddcorkum's suggestion. If such a formal apology would help people feel more welcome then that works for me. --PcjWowpedia wiki manager (TDrop me a line!•C207,729 contributions and counting) 00:20, 16 February 2020 (UTC)

Just throwing a link to the vote over on WoWWiki, for the sake of convenience. PeterWind (talk) 21:25, 20 February 2020 (UTC)